Aqua: “The Essence of [Francis is Definitely the Pope] Steve O’Reilly’s Argument is: Words don’t Matter, Error doesn’t Matter, as long as the Intent was Clear. My Argument is: Precise Words Matter such [as]… Mary’s Fiat; Eucharistic Consecration; Papal Abdication”
The Catholic Monitor hosted a mini debate with the publisher of .RomaLocutaEst, Steven O’Reilly, who is a former intelligence officer in his visit to its comment section in which he argued with the well known commenter Aqua on if Francis is definitely the pope or an antipope. (https://www.thecatholicmonitor.com/2022/04/the-catholic-monitor-aqua-debate-steven.html)
Here is Aqua’s take on the debate with O’Reilly:
I went back through Steve’s comments looking for any direct commentary on the central issue of contention: Benedict XVI’s resignation of what the Pope DOES; Benedict XVI’s clear and adamant retention of what the Pope IS – he resigned Ministerium; he retained Munus.
My contention with Steve O’Reilly has been over his refusal to argue that essential point. I finally found this:
– Steve O’Reilly quote –
“So bottom line…the Roman Pontiff can resign the papacy. Any numbers of words might be used. There is no list of approved and unapproved words. There is no formula for that. He could say…”I renounce the papacy.” Valid. Full stop. The word “munus” does not need to be used. I believe even Estefania Acosta admits that *narrow* point.
The term “mininisterium/ministero” may include ‘office’ among its definitions. That combined with the fact that Benedict said he renounced the Petrine ministry ‘in such a way’ that the “See of Rome, See of Peter will be vacant”, etc., makes it quite evidence what he was doing. Resigning the papacy. What else leaves the See of Rome, the See of Peter vacant? The answer is obvious. A papal death or resignation. That is what leaves the See vacant. There are no ifs, ands, or buts about it.
Finally, though not necessary, but for those ‘demanding’ munus, we can see the logic of the whole text. He starts off using ‘munus’ saying he is unable to continue due to age/weakness, and a few sentences later uses the term ministerium in the same way, noting his age/weakness. So the two are logically interchangeable, and we have it on authority, such as Cardinal Burke they are used interchangeably. Why did he make the transition or switch to ministerium? Ultimately, it doesn’t matter…but it has been suggested he preferred the more personalistic/relational tone of the use of “ministry.”
– end Steve O’Reilly quote –
As with the entire parallel post-conciliar Vatican II newchurch™️, Steve’s argument (above) boils down to this:
“It’s good enough, close enough, meanings and definitions are open to interpretation and intent; we know what he meant to do; we don’t know why he did what he did, said what he said – don’t know why he calls himself Emeritus, don’t know why he still uses the honorific Holiness, don’t know why he still lives in the Vatican. We know what he meant. It is what it is. What will he will be. The Church has already spoken and we must do what they say. The Church is indefectible so any questions must submit to authority which is always right. And so … Ministerium = Munus. Canon Law says Munus, but any old word will do also. The action is concrete and so the intent is clear. The Pope controls Canon Law and if he says Ministerium = Munus then it is so. If the Pope wants to simply say ‘That’s all folks’, he can. If the Pope wants to remain as an Emeritus Pope, even though he dreamed it up himself – the Pope can do whatever he wants – he is unconstrained by law; a law unto himself. In sum: If the Pope wishes it to be true, then it is true”.
I do not believe that. I believe shortcuts and expedience lead to heresy and are the Devil’s raw material for his lies and deception to take root. Precision is a core element of the Faith, because there is only *One Way*, and, the *road is narrow; gate is small that lead to life*.
Ministerium ≠ Munus. Ministerium is not even ≈ (approx) Munus. One is one thing. The other is a different thing.
Ministerium = Bergoglio (it was resigned).
Munus = Benedict XVI (it was not resigned).
Thus, the essence of Steve O’Reilly’s argument is: words don’t matter, error doesn’t matter, as long as the intent was clear.
My argument is: precise words matter such that at some times the entire Universe hangs upon them – Mary’s Fiat; Eucharistic consecration; Papal abdication. [https://www.thecatholicmonitor.com/2022/04/the-catholic-monitor-aqua-debate-steven.html]
Pray an Our Father now for reparation for the sins committed because of Francis’s Amoris Laetitia.
Pray an Our Father now for the restoration of the Church as well as the Triumph of the Kingdom of the Sacred Heart and the Immaculate Heart of Mary.
Stop for a moment of silence, ask Jesus Christ what He wants you to do now and next. In this silence remember God, Father, Son and Holy Ghost – Three Divine Persons yet One God, has an ordered universe where you can know truth and falsehood as well as never forget that He wants you to have eternal happiness with Him as his son or daughter by grace. Make this a practice. By doing this you are doing more good than reading anything here or anywhere else on the Internet.
– Doctor of the Church St. Francis de Sales totally confirmed beyond any doubt the possibility of a heretical pope and what must be done by the Church in such a situation:
“[T]he Pope… WHEN he is EXPLICITLY a heretic, he falls ipso facto from his dignity and out of the Church, and the Church MUST either deprive him, or, as some say, declare him deprived, of his Apostolic See.”
(The Catholic Controversy, by St. Francis de Sales, Pages 305-306)
Saint Robert Bellarmine, also, said “the Pope heretic is not deposed ipso facto, but must be declared deposed by the Church.”
– “If Francis is a Heretic, What should Canonically happen to him?”: http://www.thecatholicmonitor.com/2020/12/if-francis-is-heretic-what-should.html
– “Could Francis be a Antipope even though the Majority of Cardinals claim he is Pope?”: http://www.thecatholicmonitor.com/2019/03/could-francis-be-antipope-even-though.html
– LifeSiteNews, “Confusion explodes as Pope Francis throws magisterial weight behind communion for adulterers,” December 4, 2017:
The AAS guidelines explicitly allows “sexually active adulterous couples facing ‘complex circumstances’ to ‘access the sacraments of Reconciliation and the Eucharist.'”
– On February 2018, in Rorate Caeli, Catholic theologian Dr. John Lamont:
“The AAS statement… establishes that Pope Francis in Amoris Laetitia has affirmed propositions that are heretical in the strict sense.”
– On December 2, 2017, Bishop Rene Gracida:
“Francis’ heterodoxy is now official. He has published his letter to the Argentina bishops in Acta Apostlica Series making those letters magisterial documents.”
Pray an Our Father now for the restoration of the Church by the bishops by the grace of God.
– Intel Cryptanalyst-Mathematician on Biden Steal: “212Million Registered Voters & 66.2% Voting,140.344 M Voted…Trump got 74 M, that leaves only 66.344 M for Biden” [http://catholicmonitor.blogspot.com/2020/12/intel-cryptanalyst-mathematician-on.html?m=1]
– Will US be Venezuela?: Ex-CIA Official told Epoch Times “Chávez started to Focus on [Smartmatic] Voting Machines to Ensure Victory as early as 2003”: http://catholicmonitor.blogspot.com/2020/12/will-us-be-venezuela-ex-cia-official.html
– Tucker Carlson’s Conservatism Inc. Biden Steal Betrayal is explained by “One of the Greatest Columns ever Written” according to Rush: http://catholicmonitor.blogspot.com/2021/01/tucker-carlsons-conservatism-inc-biden.html?m=1
– A Hour which will Live in Infamy: 10:01pm November 3, 2020:
What is needed right now to save America from those who would destroy our God given rights is to pray at home or in church and if called to even go to outdoor prayer rallies in every town and city across the United States for God to pour out His grace on our country to save us from those who would use a Reichstag Fire-like incident to destroy our civil liberties. [Is the DC Capitol Incident Comparable to the Nazi Reichstag Fire Incident where the German People Lost their Civil Liberties?: http://catholicmonitor.blogspot.com/2021/01/is-dc-capital-incident-comparable-to.html?m=1 and Epoch Times Show Crossroads on Capitol Incident: “Anitfa ‘Agent Provocateurs‘”:
Pray an Our Father now for the grace to know God’s Will and to do it.